Ukraine was ‘sea change' for spies – GCHQ head

The Ukraine struggle has led to a oversea alteration for quality agencies, the caput of GCHQ Sir Jeremy Fleming has said.

Washington and London some took the antithetic measurement of publicising their cognition of Russia's plans and attempts to warrant its penetration of Ukraine.

The caput of US intelligence, Avril Haines, said lessons had been learned including the limits of specified moves to publicise intelligence.

She was interviewed by Sir Jeremy arsenic portion of his relation arsenic a impermanent exertion of Radio 4's Today programme.

As a 30-year seasoned of the concealed world, Sir Jeremy Fleming said the enactment of declassifying quality was "quite hard successful galore ways" but determination was nary constituent collecting secrets unless they could beryllium utilized and, helium said, Ukraine had seen a caller benignant of struggle successful which quality was astatine the forefront.

"Keeping the colonisation up to day connected what we're seeing and involving them successful the speech successful a much important mode is crucial," Ms Haines added successful her speech with Sir Jeremy.

As Director of National Intelligence, Ms Haines co-ordinates each America's spy agencies and she played a pivotal relation successful pushing for delicate quality to beryllium declassified and published successful the tally up to Russia's February invasion. This antithetic measurement was designed to deter Russia and antagonistic its claims it was acting defensively.

"We were capable to person an impact," Ms Haines said, "at the aforesaid times what besides is clear… is that our interaction was acold greater successful the West than it was successful different places successful the world."

In Russia, she said the efforts had "basically nary impact" due to the fact that of the power the Kremlin exerted implicit accusation flows wrong the country.

"Authoritarian states person this benignant of asymmetric vantage wherever they're efficaciously controlling the accusation to their populations," Ms Haines said. She added that Russia besides tried to instrumentality vantage of the unfastened accusation travel successful occidental societies to beforehand their narratives and exacerbate divisions successful society.

Working retired however to recognize and antagonistic this overseas power was a increasing country for Western quality communities, she said.

"The Russians engaged successful a precise concerted accusation run astir the satellite connected these issues," she said.

"One of their main narratives is the United States is provoking this conflict, and that Nato and Ukraine are mounting the conditions and threatening Russia and that benignant of forced them into this position."

Sir Jeremy besides said "much of the world" had not wholly bought the Western broadside of the argument. The GCHQ caput said it was important that it was not conscionable authorities oregon quality bureau voices retired successful the debate.

"There are antithetic alliances, which alteration america to amusement and show that we are much trusted," helium said.

Sir Jeremy said the backstage assemblage had played an important portion successful the struggle - whether outer imagery from backstage providers, which could corroborate the quality claims astir unit build-ups - oregon the enactment of companies similar Microsoft successful providing cyber-defence for Ukraine.

In different interrogation for the programme Sir Jeremy rejected the thought that GCHQ had been dragged into the unfastened by Edward Snowden's revelations, claiming the erstwhile US quality worker publishing details of concealed programmes had outgo the UK "blood and money".

Asked if his successor could beryllium the archetypal pistillate to pb GCHQ, Sir Jeremy said "let's anticipation so" noting the organisation had not been led by either a pistillate oregon idiosyncratic from an taste number inheritance and that it was clip to "show a quality astatine the top" of quality agencies.

Listen to the afloat interrogation connected Best of Today connected BBC Sounds.